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Van Ham - The handling session

A forum for discussions on INS-sponsor auctions from future and past.
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AFNetsuke
Posts: 6272
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Location: Central California coast, USA

Re: Van Ham - The handling session

Postby AFNetsuke » Sat Jan 13, 2018 7:57 pm

Clive, I thought you'd be a Bitcoin kind of guy.
Alan

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Clive
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Location: UK

Re: Van Ham - The handling session

Postby Clive » Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:10 am

AFNetsuke wrote:Clive, I thought you'd be a Bitcoin kind of guy.


I was but now I'm into Ethereum and web 3.0 stuff until Hashgraph, Tangle or something else look better.

Interesting times ;)

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neilholton
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Re: Van Ham - The handling session

Postby neilholton » Sun Jan 14, 2018 1:28 pm

I think judging tall figures is a very complex activity.

Labelling this netsuke a Dutchman is trivualising the Netsuke’s brilliance somewhat.

The sailor is just about to humanely stretch the neck of the Rabbit. His concentration is momentarily focussed towards something to left, which clearly pleases him. The Rabbit, which to most is a secondary aspect of the netsuke is actually supremely important to the composition, the artist has captured that moment where the rabbit receives a slight momentary reprieve from execution. He’s experiencing a near death experience, but it won’t last long, he'll forever know in a moment what death feels like!

It is an amazing example of how original these artists could be. The studio it hails from is important and was consistently innovative in subject matter.

I guess what you have to ask, if you said I’ll write a cheque for 100K if you can get me another, I would have to answer I could buy you other figures by the studio equally individual but not the same.

One London authority I am sure will have identified they own a figure, equal in size and certainly originality by the same studio, question is, whats his worth today!

lohrberg
Posts: 243
Joined: Sun Nov 22, 2015 10:31 am
Location: Hannover - Germany

Re: Van Ham - The handling session

Postby lohrberg » Sun Jan 14, 2018 1:29 pm

Clive wrote:Every time I see this thread it gives me a huge smile.. :)


There is something else remarkable in Gabor's judgement, which is obviously overlooked here. The price paid at Van Ham is surely supersensational, no doubt about it. Gabor rated the quality of this netsuke decades ago as not supersensational .
The buyer in Cologne was willing to pay the supersensational price for a piece, which in his eyes must be of supersensational quality.
Was Gabor wrong? I think he was right.
My personal conclusion: Even for those not supersensational pieces süpersensational prices are paid.
Netsuke world, a ridiculous market sometimes, lots to laugh about, lots of fun ........
Clive, may be not just a smile, try your laughing muscles,

Reinhard

lohrberg
Posts: 243
Joined: Sun Nov 22, 2015 10:31 am
Location: Hannover - Germany

Re: Van Ham - The handling session

Postby lohrberg » Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:17 pm

Smile or laugh

A third variation may be?

As Helen Hurtig proclaimed:

NETSUKE IS -

TO GRIN AND "BARE" IT
,

Reinhard

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Clive
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Location: UK

Re: Van Ham - The handling session

Postby Clive » Sun Jan 14, 2018 6:51 pm

:lol: :lol:

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souldeep
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Location: London

Re: Van Ham - The handling session

Postby souldeep » Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:34 pm

I hark back to the time of the Rose sale. Complaints about "big bidder" bamboozled me. I remember writing something along of the lines of "but you have a deeper pocket than me, I feel hard done by you in auctions, now you feel hard done by another".

Does the subject valuation of price just remain that, and if so, should it not boil down to - is the tall figure an honest good thing?

It took at least two pockets to reach that price. And, from being in the room, one could see Mr Moss was a close third.

So what do I personally conclude;

1) A very positive result for all collectors that own big ivory pieces. With everything going on, there is still a market and it holds our collections to value if that actually matters to us?
2) In counter to point 1) - As collectors, some will care that our pieces are worth something, but ultimately one of us may find the "pocket money" to buy a piece for 10k, another may consider the "pocket money" to be buying for 100k. If we collect for the sake of collecting, what does the financial cost matter if it's just "pocket money"?
3) Who set's a value for this art except for the winner, and the underbidder? Who defines "supersensational "? This is really subjective, right?
4) Ongoing question from point 2), but would any of us turned that piece down if we had of been walking around an antique market and seen it for $500?
Piglet: "Pooh?" Pooh: "Yes, Piglet?" Piglet: "I've been thinking..." Pooh: "That's a very good habit to get into to, Piglet." - A.A. Milne.

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AFNetsuke
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Location: Central California coast, USA

Re: Van Ham - The handling session

Postby AFNetsuke » Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:09 am

souldeep wrote:Ongoing question from point 2), but would any of us turned that piece down if we had of been walking around an antique market and seen it for $500?

At that price I would rub my eyes and wonder why I could not see it might be a great fake...and quickly buy it.
Alan

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jbjtennyo
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Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2008 8:38 pm
Location: USA

Re: Van Ham - The handling session

Postby jbjtennyo » Mon Jan 15, 2018 12:46 pm

Agree, Alan. When I walk into an antique shop and find a netsuke for a fraction of what it's worth--I say it's just my turn and thank the God above for this piece of earthly gratification!
Martyn, Your thoughts are right on - carefully thought through. When my children were growing up, I had a "saying" attached to the front of my refrigerator. It read " The cost of a thing is the amount of your life you are willing to exchange for it." True of life decisions, but also true of the small things that please and entertain us in this life.
Judy

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tanukisan
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Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2014 3:30 pm
Location: Solihull , West Midlands

Re: Van Ham - The handling session

Postby tanukisan » Tue Jan 16, 2018 2:59 pm

DSCF4187.JPG
DSCF4190.JPG
Better late than never - I've finally received Lot 2328 from the 7th December Van Ham Auction today!
Blind musician crawling along bearing his wrapped biwa on his back -
What is truly mind boggling though, is the size of the packaging this little musician came in :!: :!: :!:
Attachments
DSCF4185.JPG

John 



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