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Stone Netsuke

Discussions, identification and analysis of Stones and Gems used in Netsuke
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chonchon
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Postby chonchon » Sun May 17, 2015 8:33 am

Does anyone know of an example of Netsuke made of stone?

(Not counting those recent brown or green nephrite/jadeite monkeys made in China.)
Piers

Size is something.

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DSW90049
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Postby DSW90049 » Sun May 17, 2015 4:26 pm

How about this one, Piers?

http://www.takaraasianart.com/a_net_other/stonepeach_net.html


Image

"A netsuke of a peach, carved from a very unusual and beautiful stone.
This netsuke is from the collection of Raymond and Frances Bushell. It is published
in Raymond Bushell's book, Netsuke Familiar and Unfamiliar, in the chapter
about the great variety of materials used for carving netsuke (p.148, fig.325).
19th century."
"There is no shortcut to netsuke collecting; it takes time, study and patience. The market is flooded with utterly worthless rubbish. . . . "
Netsukes: Their Makers, Use and Meaning, H. Seymour Trower(1898)~~~~David

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chonchon
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Postby chonchon » Mon May 18, 2015 12:24 am

Yes, fantastic, many thanks David. A pretty piece of stone, a semi-jewel. I like the play on stone and peach, which works well in English. What does the other side look like, I find my self wondering.(?)
Piers

Size is something.

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AFNetsuke
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Postby AFNetsuke » Mon May 18, 2015 12:32 am

The other side with himotoshi is in the link David provided. I have some trouble with this item. I have to assume that Bushell acquired it in Japan in the 50's or so and thought it to be an antique netsuke so we'll maybe have to trust him on that but what's to keep it from being a moss agate carving used as a Chinese toggle of similar age? I know there are legitimate jade, malachite and other lithic netsuke but how one determines age or origin is a mystery to me...
Alan

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chonchon
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Postby chonchon » Mon May 18, 2015 1:18 am

Exactly, well put Alan, and that is the problem with stone.

The answer seems to lie partly in a minute examination of the surface scratches made by the stone-working tools. Labor/labour intensity. If threads and sand were used to cut the stone, a work that could take days and weeks, then it is probably not modern...

PS. Thanks for pointing out the link. The shape of the himotoshi holes and the general wear do give it some track record, and if we assume that Raymond bought it in the early 1950s, ...then we could be half-way there! :D
Piers

Size is something.

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chonchon
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Postby chonchon » Mon May 18, 2015 3:36 am

This one to me is reminiscent of marble, but more strongly redolent of Tofu, specifically Gomadofu, ie Sesame Tofu.
https://www.google.co.jp/search?q=%E3%81%94%E3%81%BE%E8%B1%86%E8%85%90&es_sm=93&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=Ll1ZVaOhKsfU8gXT44GoAg&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ&biw=1280&bih=685

Most Japanese are very sensitive to food textures and taste, and many Japanese things have some link to food.
http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E8%83%A1%E9%BA%BB%E8%B1%86%E8%85%90#/media/File:Goma_tofu_by_sunday_driver_in_Kyoto.jpg



Image Image
Piers

Size is something.

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jbjtennyo
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Postby jbjtennyo » Mon May 18, 2015 1:22 pm

I was told a long time ago by one of our dealers that if it is stone, it is a Chinese toggle rather than a Japanese netsuke. I have a friend who collects these, and they are always called Chinese toggles.
I have a lovely one in the shape of a tiger that I purchased before I knew this. I still love it though.:P
Images of my tiger and also a boy that I had forgotten about (similar one in an old Euronetsuke journal. I will look it up, as I forget what he is called)
Note: just looked it up: It is simply called the naked boy, and is a gift for a bride-He carries a flowering lotus with a ovoid seed pod. the symbol of many sons and grandsons, which will bring honor and wealth to the family.
Image Image Image Image
Judy

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chonchon
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Postby chonchon » Mon May 18, 2015 2:15 pm

Judy, this one may just prove your dealer needs to expand his horizon a little!

This was given to me by a Japanese person who knows I like Netsuke. I will see what information I can dig up. It does not fit the Chinese pattern, nor any other kind of pattern just yet. Some cracks and chips, and brown mottling.
Love yours. I think I may have a couple of old Chinese ones too.
Piers

Size is something.

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jbjtennyo
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Postby jbjtennyo » Mon May 18, 2015 2:56 pm

Please - Let me know!  I would love to be able to call it netsuke again!
Judy

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AFNetsuke
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Postby AFNetsuke » Mon May 18, 2015 3:12 pm

Judy, if you don't have the Chinese Toggle book that was published around 2011 you should get it. I think there is only one earlier book of any substance. Virtually every item in the latest publication has meaning, often talismanic according to the author. Lots with fertility, good fortune, happy marriage associations. We've had a short toggle discussion on the Forum in the past if you do a search you should find it associated with some pieces I posted.
Alan


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