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Marine Ivory?

Discussions, identification and analysis of the different types of Marine Ivory
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neilholton
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Postby neilholton » Sat May 31, 2014 10:14 pm


Yours Richard I think could be an obidome too…

GiantSquid
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Postby GiantSquid » Mon Jun 02, 2014 12:08 pm

Thanks Neil

Not knowing the meaning of the word, I had to look it up, and this is what I came up with:

"Obi-dome is an accessory of kimono. It's also called "Pocchiri" by people around Geisha or Maiko in Kyoto. Passing flat Obi-jime through Obi-dome and tying it. There are many kind of material of Obi-dome. For example, coral, jade, ivory, tortoise-shell, shell, crystal, gold, silver, cloisonne, pottery, glass, and so on. Basically, it should be worn with casual kimono. But if it made with jewelry, it can be worn with some formal kimono. (especially diamond, ruby, sapphire, emerald or pearl). It's supposed to be an invention of Geisha. In the latter period of Edo age [1603-1867], some Geisha adorned their obi with their customer or lover's metal fittings of Katana (Japanese sword) as vow of love. After Edo age, Katana was prohibited and artisans of Katana started making Obi-dome."

"The difficulty lies not so much in developing new ideas as in escaping from old ones." John Maynard Keynes, 1883 - 1946

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GiantSquid
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Postby GiantSquid » Mon Jun 02, 2014 12:11 pm


This website provides more info and some examples:
http://www.buttoncountry.com/Div4Obidome1.html
"The difficulty lies not so much in developing new ideas as in escaping from old ones." John Maynard Keynes, 1883 - 1946

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chonchon
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Postby chonchon » Tue Nov 10, 2015 9:26 am

We were recently wanting here: http://forums.netsuke.org/post/had-this-in-drawer-7784901?&trail=15

...a general broad marine ivory thread, but there is one on the site already.

Does anyone wish to post items that seem fairly clear as to which type of marine ivory they are, and if possible, offer a reason?
Piers

Size is something.

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LUBlub
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Postby LUBlub » Sun Nov 15, 2015 2:16 pm

Piers...

http://forums.netsuke.org/post/had-this-in-drawer-7784901?&trail=15

disappointed....in the above thread 46 post and only 7 netsuke subjects shared...
very few participation...is not the first time that we observe a very scarce
will to share photos of member collections....why?....privacy? fear to expose themselves? fear of the opinions? ....the proportion between verbal post contents and photos is dramatically in favor of words...
yes, opinion and discussions are expressed with words, but photos are the "best beef" to share including the attraction for potential new collectors ...or maybe collectors are afraid to show pieces they bought in auctions in order to hide the price?....

Mystery...but in this forum we are always the same few dozens names to post and share...

Yes, I'm disappointed...hundred and hundred and hundred of RM's all around the world...but very scarce generosity to share and participate...

David you are the new President...have you considered this situation?...
Excellence in netsuke art don't need signature or pedigree, or age, only quality, aesthetics, beauty.

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DSW90049
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Postby DSW90049 » Sun Nov 15, 2015 3:08 pm

Luigi, and all, I just ran a search of "Marine Ivory," and it returned 245 posts, across a variety of threads:

http://forums.netsuke.org/search?searchid=38710302&showas=post

More than a few include photos.

Also, "Marine Ivory" as a search, will miss any specifically named type, such as Walrus, for, but one of many examples.

We often have more than one thread on the same subject over the years.

On your more general question, Luigi, there are only some of our members and visitors who are willing to share photos of pieces in their collections. I have often wondered why myself, and in private communications I've been given many different reasons. I wish more would post and share in this Forum, both generally, and specifically with photos, but many who are involved in this field prefer their privacy and we must respect that. We can lament, but respect for privacy is essential.

Unfortunately, there is another factor at work here, currently - I just answered a friend's question yesterday about whether California's new law (effective 7-1-16), AB96, bans Walrus Tusk as a material, and I checked and this is what I found:

"1) Prohibit a person from purchasing, selling, offering for sale, possessing with intent to sell, or importing with intent to sell, ivory or rhinoceros horn, with specified exceptions. Ivory means a tooth or tusk from a species of elephant, hippopotamus, mammoth, mastodon, walrus, warthog, whale, or narwhal, whether raw or worked, as specified." (emphasis added)

http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/pub/15-16/bill/asm/ab_0051-0100/ab_96_cfa_20150619_144513_sen_comm.html
"There is no shortcut to netsuke collecting; it takes time, study and patience. The market is flooded with utterly worthless rubbish. . . . "
Netsukes: Their Makers, Use and Meaning, H. Seymour Trower(1898)~~~~David

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LUBlub
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Postby LUBlub » Sun Nov 15, 2015 5:02 pm

Tks so much David for your time and research's...
I was disappointed but now in front of your summary the picture is very sad...

Just few people showing his "face" and collections, and probably in this
present situation with a percentage of risks ...who knows in future the kind of controls and restrictions will be impose?...here in the INS they have all evidences and photographic material in case will be the obligation to "declare" what you have....for the moment here in Europe no problem but Germany and UK are slowly moving following the steps of USA...

Again, (RIGHTLY because they are paying members), , hundreds RM's read the Journal and watch this forum and take profit of all and any improvement in the knowledge of Netsuke Art...all that passively without share anything and no any risk and with absolute privacy to respect...

I try to imagine if the few dozens of active and generous Members showing the face will decide to adopt the same "private attitude", well, this forum would be the Sahara desert....

Much better to see the half glass full..what else David?...
:roll:


Excellence in netsuke art don't need signature or pedigree, or age, only quality, aesthetics, beauty.

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DSW90049
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Postby DSW90049 » Sun Nov 15, 2015 7:02 pm

More than a few have called me an Eternal Optimist, Luigi; so, yes, I tend to always view the glass as being half full, indeed!

There are MANY materials which compose the netsuke, sagemono and the myriad of other Japanese items in which our members and guests have an interest and collect, study or simply admire, and those other materials are not endangered or legally restricted, such as woods (dozens of species), stag, ceramic and porcelain, nuts including Tagua, lacquer, and much more. We must view the current situation, at least in the U.S., as waiting for the storm to blow over and for the skies to clear again. Further, our purpose here is to educate and help each other along. Nobody can be forced to lift their self-imposed veil of privacy, but much gratitude always to those who do generously share on this Forum!
"There is no shortcut to netsuke collecting; it takes time, study and patience. The market is flooded with utterly worthless rubbish. . . . "
Netsukes: Their Makers, Use and Meaning, H. Seymour Trower(1898)~~~~David

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Tama
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Postby Tama » Sun Nov 15, 2015 7:26 pm

I noticed that it didn't say anything about owning the various types of ivory or trading said ivory. A loophole?

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Clive
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Postby Clive » Mon Nov 16, 2015 12:28 am

DSW90049 wrote:We must view the current situation, at least in the U.S., as waiting for the storm to blow over and for the skies to clear again.


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