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Exercises for beginning collectors

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Oishii
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Location: Belgium

Re: Reading signatures

Postby Oishii » Sun Dec 10, 2017 7:41 pm

HLH wrote:First I answered KARAKO because I thought it was a china boy but I couln't see the dress properly.
OK. I change this to SARUMAWASHI (sleeping monkey trainer)

Your assignment to post a sarumawashi was done well, it is a good example of this common model.
Now this will be a subject that you will not forget easily :)

HLH wrote:The "F" netsuke is a NLO. The hand and feet without details ...
Screen Shot 2017-12-10 at 20.27.18.png

I'm afraid we can't give you an A on that answer, Henrik ;-)

Piece F is an authentic Edo period netsuke. Do not be mislead by the lack of intricate detail.
Sometimes, an NLO may be more intricately carved than an Edo period netsuke. So, don't think in these categories.
So, when you see a piece that does not have so much detail, you might consider some other elements, like :
* age of the material : in time, you will be able to judge the age of wood and ivory, of which the patina is an important element.
* naturalness of the piece. Edo pieces will almost always be a bit more natural and many times a bit more realistic than NLO as well.
These carvers were also very good at bringing expression to a netsuke : cute, fierce, funny etc...
* the crafmanship : the quality and artistic standard is almost always higher than in NLO pieces.
* common Edo models : when going over the pieces offered at an auction, you will notice pieces that you seem to have seen before.
It is true that some models (like the sarumawashi) were repeated many, many times. The commonness points to it probably being old.

Here are a few authentic pieces that are relatively simple models, with hands and feet without much detail.
(sometimes the fine hairwork, like that of the pupy and the tanuki may have worn off)
simple.jpg

HLH wrote:the himotoshi isn't nice...
himotoshi.png

There is a bit of damage near the sides of the himotoshi, but these are quite nice himotoshi.
When you encounter uneven (one bigger than the other) holes, it is usually a sign of good age.
Here are a few examples of this kind of good himotoshi :
exampleshimo.jpg


To be continued !
Last edited by Oishii on Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:14 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Reason: sentence added.
Jan

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Oishii
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Location: Belgium

Re: Reading signatures

Postby Oishii » Mon Dec 11, 2017 4:54 pm

HLH wrote:6. Which piece has the most wear, with some parts actually worn off ?
..C looks well worn................

7. Do you see any damage or missing parts ? Where ?
...E the head seem to have some kind but hard to tell.......................................

Hi Henrik,

Let's study a few pictures of piece C, the well worn 18th C one.

Apart from the feet, which are almost completely lost, do you see any damage or missing parts ?
Take a close look at all the edges and corners.
Do you see both hands of this figure ?
Is a particular area somewhat edgy and sharp ? Might something be missing there ?
Would this damage keep you away from wanting this piece in your collection ?
Other members may chime in to give hints about the subject of this piece and what may be missing here.
Front view
Screen Shot 2017-12-11 at 17.36.16.png

View from above the backside :
Screen Shot 2017-12-11 at 17.44.35.png
Jan

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HLH
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Location: Sweden

Re: Reading signatures

Postby HLH » Mon Dec 11, 2017 6:49 pm

Jan,
He has lost his left hand for some very rough handling. Also his left shoulder has a sharp something...maybe holding a missing part.
For that part I like to have him in my collection because this kind of genuine patina and natural wear. We must consider that he's been around for at least 200 years. By the way, did they inheritate the netsuke father to son, or what happened when the owner died?
I haven't identified this sen-nin yet but I'm searching.
Henrik

Be careful out there
鬼は外、福は内

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Oishii
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Re: Reading signatures

Postby Oishii » Tue Dec 12, 2017 10:14 am

Hi Henrik,

now that the 6 study pieces have been sold, let's take a look at the prices they made and see if we can draw any conclusions.
- the 18th/19th C pieces, like the sarumawashi, did not bad. The damage of the figure may have kept the price lower.
- the modern, NLO-like pieces went cheap, but there was one exception : which piece, clearly an NLO, has sold for more that it may be worth ?
Henrik, we hope that your increasing knowledge in this field may guide you in your appreciation and help you in the acquisition of authentic netsuke !
hunting.jpg
Jan

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HLH
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Re: Reading signatures

Postby HLH » Tue Dec 12, 2017 11:23 am

Jan,
Interesting to see the difference, my favorite sold only for 80 but the new tiger sold unfortunately for the buyer for to much. I think that animals as tigers, lions, wolfs etc... are very popular among many people. Thats why the high price. The monkey was also a bit to expensive as you can get NLO in H.K. for about a third or less. The Sarumawashi fetch a good fair price and I’ll try to get a simular one for my collection.
I much enjoyed this quiz as it helped me get on track in the difficult art to identify new from old. I’ve learn to inspect the pieces more carefully and look for details in carvings. But I need a lot more of these exercises to be confident to what I’m doing as I’ll take the ”wrong turn” a number of times.
Henrik

Be careful out there
鬼は外、福は内

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tanukisan
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Location: Solihull , West Midlands

Re: Reading signatures

Postby tanukisan » Tue Dec 12, 2017 2:28 pm

Oishii wrote:Other members may chime in to give hints about the subject of this piece and what may be missing here.

file.png

To be honest, I'm a bit puzzled about this figure myself - he wears mugwort characteristic of a sennin but holds the Tengu king's feathered war fan and possibly a sheathed sword on his back, or is the remains of a dragon emerging from a container?

John 


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HLH
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Re: Reading signatures

Postby HLH » Tue Dec 12, 2017 6:40 pm

Hi John,

Which Sen-nin?
Thanks for your comments. I've been looking for a simular piece, but no luck yet. The question is what is missing? Could it be something supported by the missing left hand? Or maybe this missing item was supported by an invisible hand as I can't see if theres any harm done to the hand wrist, its just missing.
Henrik

Be careful out there
鬼は外、福は内

onimh
Posts: 550
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Location: Boston

Re: Reading signatures

Postby onimh » Tue Dec 12, 2017 8:32 pm

Gomo is a Sennin with a feather fan but i don't know more about him.

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HLH
Posts: 136
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Location: Sweden

Re: Reading signatures

Postby HLH » Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:35 pm

Hi onimh,

Thanks but I can’t find anything on ”gomo sen-nin”. Do you have any reference as Google don’t give any useful hits.
Henrik

Be careful out there
鬼は外、福は内


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